WHICH TRIBULATION?

[Laurie Mosher]

Mat 24:21  For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
Mat 24:22  And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Dan 12:1  And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

IS the great tribulation the same as the time of trouble? Matt 24:21-22 THE SAME AS Daniel 12:1?

[Sister Marie]

This is a very interesting question. I have been wondering it myself. I have a tendency to believe it is the same, but can't say I am sure on this.

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With Christian Love,
Sister Marie

[Richard Myers]

As I recall in my studies I came the conclusion that there are two times of trouble. One is "little" time of trouble and then there is the time of trouble such as never was. I believe the time of trouble such as never was is the most fearful thing presented in the Bible. "And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name. Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus." Revelation 14:9-12.

[Laurie Mosher]

 So is the "little time of trouble" the same as "Jacob's Touble"?

[This message has been edited by Laurie Mosher (edited 10-07-2005).]

[Liane H]

Here is a statement from the Spirit of Prophecy that may help:

"Then Jesus will step out from between the Father and men, and God will keep silence no longer, but pour out His wrath on those who have rejected His truth. I saw that the anger of the nations, the wrath of God, and the time to judge the dead, were separate and distinct, one following the other; also that Michael had not stood up, and that the time of trouble, such as never was, had not yet commenced. The nations are now getting angry, but when our High Priest has finished His work in the sanctuary, He will stand up, put on the garments of vengeance, and then the seven last plagues will be poured out." {CET 100.2}

Yet again, I will have to check further I think I understood that Jesus left the Most Holy Place between the sixth and seventh plague?

Liane, the Zoo Mama

[David MD]

Mat 24:29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:”

If we believe these events have already happened then we must conclude that the "tribulation" of Mat 24:21 is the 1260 years.

Indeed this great tribulation was cut short because of truths from God.

The time of trouble of Dan 12 is after probation closes and will be a time without any earthy support but will not last 1260 years.  Nor should we underestimate the persecution of God peoples in the Dark Ages.

[Richard Myers]

Amen Dr. David!

Brother Laurie asks " So is the 'little time of trouble' the same as 'Jacob's Trouble'?"

I don't think so. At least Jacob would not agree with you.   The time of Jacob's trouble, is the time of trouble such as never was. The 144,000 have their faith tried in the fire just as did Jacob the night he wrestled with Christ.

[David MD]

"From the destruction of Jerusalem, Christ passed on rapidly to the greater event, the last link in the chain of this earth’s history,--the coming of the Son of God in majesty and glory. Between these two events, there lay open to Christ’s view long centuries of darkness, centuries for His [BEGIN P.631] church marked with blood and tears and agony. Upon these scenes His disciples could not then endure to look, and Jesus passed them by with a brief mention. "Then shall be great tribulation," He said, "such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect’s sake those days shall be shortened." For more than a thousand years such persecution as the world had never before known was to come upon Christ’s followers. Millions upon millions of His faithful witnesses were to be slain. Had not God’s hand been stretched out to preserve His people, all would have perished. "But for the elect’s sake," He said, "those days shall be shortened." {DA 630.5}
White, E. G. 1898; 2002. The Desire of Ages; Conflict of the Ages Series, Volume 3; Desire of Ages . Pacific Press Publishing Association

[David MD]

 "And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince [BEGIN P.213] which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, everyone that shall be found written in the book." When this time of trouble comes, every case is decided; there is no longer probation, no longer mercy for the impenitent. The seal of the living God is upon His people. This small remnant, unable to defend themselves in the deadly conflict with the powers of earth that are marshaled by the dragon host, make God their defense. The decree has been passed by the highest earthly authority that they shall worship the beast and receive his mark under pain of persecution and death. May God help His people now, for what can they then do in such a fearful conflict without His assistance! {5T 212.5}
Testimonies for the Church, Volume 5. 1855; 2002 . Pacific Press Publishing Association