Hell

[Richard Myers]

The Bible talks about hell. Many churches teach about Hell. There are some who believe God is going to punish all who do not accept Christ in a place called everlasting Hell. They believe that the soul is eternal and will never be destroyed. This is untrue. "The soul that sinneth, it shall die." Ezekiel 18:20.  

Our loving God will not burn forever anyone. The punishment that goes to the unrepentant sinner is equal to his sins. No more, no less. There are others in Christian churches who teach that God is too good to punish the wicked. Another lie that has no foundation in Scripture.

"For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly; And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly; And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:  (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds; )  The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished." 2 Peter 2:4-9.

[This message has been edited by Richard Myers (edited 02-25-2005).]

[Laurie Mosher]

Rev 20:14  And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Rev 20:10  And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Actually, this fire goes out. The Bible says the wicked become ashes, AND Satan burns up too.

Ashes means COLD, because when we consider that the righteous shall tread on the ashes of the wicked, we're not going to be walking over hot coals!

Malachi 4:1  For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

Eze 28:18  Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

Satan (Lucifer) becomes ashes...the fire goes out! Hell and death are terminated.

Nahum 1:9  What do ye imagine against the LORD? he will make an utter end: affliction shall not rise up the second time.

AS in:
Rev 21:4  And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

Praise God, what do you say!

Keep "the" faith, but pass it around!
Laurie

[This message has been edited by Laurie Mosher (edited 02-25-2005).]

[Ele Holmes]

The Bible gives us no proof that there is an eternally burning hell. If there is such a place, it should be mentioned in the Sacred Book.  Why can't people believe this? Their beliefs are that you burn forever and ever, OR God is love and will save every one in the end....

Have you ever known a person ending up in an Insane assylum  because someone told her her baby would not be in heaven because it was not baptized, OR your husband died in sin and will not go to heaven, or you will burn in hell forever and ever and ever.....

This teaching has to be the worst.... How could people believe such a lie? It is so sad, so sick to think that someone would burn  in hell so many years......  God is love, but He also is just.

[This message has been edited by Ele Holmes (edited 02-25-2005).]

[Randy S]

Unfortunately, many accept as truth what their religous leaders tell them, rather than studying things out for themselves.  For much of earth's history, there wasn't much choice, since the Scriptures were either unavailable or the people were largely illiterate.

Religous leaders have a powerful incentive to teach everlasting hellfire.  Since what the "church" has to offer is salvation in the next life, it pays to have the consequences be as extremely dire as possible.  Someone who can deliver from (or condemn to) everlasting torment is to be listened to, revered, supported, and obeyed.

As slanderous a picture as everlasting torment portrays of God, it's even worse when combined with other beliefs, such as predestination.  Then you have a God who not only tortures a person by burning them alive, never satisfied that they have suffered enough, but also a God who chose and predestined them to be lost and to suffer eternally.

We should always remember what Ellen White told us the original charges were that Satam made against God's character: that He was arbitrary, unforgiving and severe.  Eternal torment is but one aspect that Satan uses to press these same accusations among mankind.  It is no wonder that so many thinking people decide they cannot love and admire a God like that.  I couldn't either.  We need to do everything we can to help get the truth out about God's character.  The best way to do that is to encourage people to study God's Word.

[Ele Holmes]

Ellen G. White quotes in 1T 25

I have since thought that many inmates of insane asylums were brought there by experiences similar to my own. Their consciences were stricken with a sense of sin, and their trembling faith dared not claim the promised pardon of God.

They listened to descriptions of the orthodox hell until it seemed to curdle the very blood in their veins, and burned an impression upon the tablets of their memory. Waking or sleeping, the frightful picture was ever before them, until reality became lost in imagination, and they saw only the wreathing flames of a fabulous hell, and heard only the shrieking of the doomed.

Reason became dethroned, and the brain was filled with the wild phantasy of a terrible dream. Those who teach the doctrine of an eternal hell would do well to look more closely after their authority for so cruel a belief.

[Liane H]

When I was a child of about four or five there was this real big book in my grandparents home that I looked at one day. I remember it as clear as if were today as I went from page to page and picture to picture of what hell was like.

When I was about 33 I decided to study the bible for myself a few years before I became a Seventh-day Adventist. There was three things I wanted to know and one was about hell.

I asked God to show me the truth about hell and if it was true then teach me to accept it. Bless His wonderful Spirit as He led me from Scripture to Scripture and I learned about immortal soul was a lie and hell was a lie.

The Scriptures can indeed speak for themselves if one allows the Holy Spirit to open their hearts and minds to the truth.

Liane, the Zoo Mama    

[Ele Holmes]

GOD'S JUSTICE is good
How repugnant to every emotion of love and mercy, and even to our sense of justice, is the doctrine that the wicked dead are tormented with fire and brimstone in an eternally burning hell, that for the sins of a brief earthly life they are to suffer torture as long as God shall live....

Where, in the pages of God's Word, is such teaching to be found? Will the redeemed in heaven be lost to all emotions of pity and compassion, and even to feelings of common humanity? No, no; such is not the teaching of the Book of God. . . .

The theory of eternal torment is one of the false docrines that constitute the wine of the abominations of Babylon.

The principles of kindness, mercy and love, taught and exemplified by our Saviour, are a transcript of the will and character of God..... God executes justice upon the wicked, for the good of the universe....
Taken FLB 176

[This message has been edited by Ele Holmes (edited 03-06-2005).]

[Richard Myers]

God is perfectly just. The only thing unjust that I can find about God is that He suffered in my place. It was not fair, but then this is the character of my God. Those who do not accept this great sacrifice will suffer in exact proportion to their sins. No more no less.

Mercy did not set aside justice, nor did justice preclude mercy. But, it was God who suffered not guilty man, or even holy angels.

[Ele Holmes]

Oh Richard, I agree.  He suffered for my many, many sins..... But what is even worse,  when I look at this filthy world of sin, horrible, horrible, abortions,  gays, killings, adultery, child abuse, etc etc....and how many of those people will be in heaven.....Jesus suffered FOR THEM TOO.  What a waste,  What horrible pain,    He did not need to suffer for them, that was all in vein, BUT  Can you see His love, His strong love for the sinner?  It sure makes me love Him so much more and  try harder in keeping my heart clean and clear for only HIM.

With Easter coming up soon, March 27th,   Think about giving out Passion books, (Doug Batchelor) and Richard's CD's.....Give out the Truth of His word.

[Laurie Mosher]

Some time ago I prepared a study called "WHO IS IN CHARGE OF HELL, GOD OR THE DEVIL?"

    Be careful! How YOU answer this question ultimately bears upon which reward you may receive when Christ returns.

    God told Adam and Eve that the results of disobedience would lead to death. Gen 2:17  (God’s Word)  But you must never eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil because when you eat from it, you will certainly die."

    But Satan, under disguise as a serpent, told Eve that she would not die if she disobeyed God. Gen 3:4  And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

WHO IS RIGHT, God or Satan? Revelation 12:9 and John 8:44 state that Satan (also known as the devil, the serpent and the dragon) is a liar and the father of lies, while Titus 1:2 tells us that God cannot lie.

2Tim 1:10  But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel:

  Rev 22:14  Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

AS YOU CAN SEE, the Bible tells us that Christ has abolished death for all those who truly believe in Him and accept God’s plan of salvation for mankind.

  There are many more texts which will be further addressed in Study 14  The Nature of Man. Rev 12:12  (Good News Bible)  And so be glad, you heavens, and all you that live there! But how terrible for the earth and the sea! For the Devil has come down to you, and he is filled with rage, because he knows that he has only a little time left."

  The devil is going to die! His specialty is deceit, but the devil is going into the Lake of Fire as described in
    Rev 20:10  And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

When we further read Malachi 4:1-3, we discover that the fire goes out, and Ezekiel 28:15-17 further states that Satan himself becomes ashes.

HOWEVER! Before this happens, Satan and his angels will appear as angels of light and righteousness to try and deceive.
2Co 11:13-15  For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

OBVIOUSLY GOD is in charge of Heaven, hell and death. BUT if you believe that everyone lives forever in either heaven or hell, HOW WILL YOU ESCAPE SATAN”S LIES?

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People who walk with God always get to their destination.
Brother Laurie

[Liane H]

One of the most quoted verses in the Bible from all Christian religions is found in John:

3:16   For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.  

The word perish stands out, but so many pass it by without realizing the meaning of this word.

What could be more clear as well is the verse states only thouse that believeth in Him shall have eternal life, it says nothing about the wicked having eternal life.

The other one that many read and do not understand is found in Matthew:

10:28   And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.  

Them meaning man, satan and fallen angels can kill the body, but Him, meaning God can destroy both body and soul. Notice the first can kill, but God can destroy.

Two simple verses taken in context with so many others is clear how our Father's character is in regards to His creation.

Without mercy justice would not be fair. Only God can read the heart and know the mind of His creatures. Only He can judge fairly and met out the final judgment.

His character mingled with love and grace shows us how wonderful He is. How fair He is. How just He is.

Liane, the Zoo Mama

[Ele Holmes]

Laurie, I sure appreciated your post above.... And liane, regarding John 3;16, I never referred to it as a proof when explaining hell and eternal fire....thank you much.

Laurie and lianne, please go to ABA "Bible Doctrines" and add your comments to the "Hell subject there.  Very important for those believing in eternal fire. Very important Doctrine.  Thank you.

[Brian M]

The Cross and Its Shadow by Stephen N. Haskell, pages 126-127 (Chapter titled "The Sin Offering)

After he blood was presented before the Lord, there was yet an important work for the sinner to perform. With his own hands he was to remove all the fat from the different organs of the animal offered as a sin-offering (Lev 7:30, 31), and give it to the priest, who burned it upon the brazen altar. At first thought this might seem a strange ceremony, but when we remember that the fat represented sin (Ps 37:20; Isa 43:23, 24), se see that it is a fitting ceremony...

...We can imagine him (David) watching the sinner separating the fat and the priest placing it upon the great altar, and presently nothing remained but ashes. In it he saw ashes only as the final end of all who would not separate from sin (Mal 4:1-3); for if the sin was a part of themselves, then when the sin was burned, they would be burned with it. The only reason God will ever destroy a sinner is because the sinner keeps sin in his own character, and will not separate from it.

[Kevin Hellerud]

It is sad as to how entrenched this deception is, and non has caused more Athiests. However sometimes we are not much better. We get to the end of time and we take folks and we roast them and toast them and have the end of the world a barbecue. But it might be wise to open up strongs concordance and Mrs. White's writings and study out the fire texts and find out just what (or rather WHO) hell fire actually is.

A hint, hell fire does indeed burn forever, and the lost are killed in hell fire, but Isaiah 33 (and I believer that you will discover that other texts and Mrs. White agree) that the saved get to burn forever and ever in the true hell fire.

[Mimi]

It is sad as to how entrenched this deception is, and non has caused more Athiests. However sometimes we are not much better. We get to the end of time and we take folks and we roast them and toast them and have the end of the world a barbecue. But it might be wise to open up strongs concordance and Mrs. White's writings and study out the fire texts and find out just what (or rather WHO) hell fire actually is.

A hint, hell fire does indeed burn forever, and the lost are killed in hell fire, but Isaiah 33 (and I believer that you will discover that other texts and Mrs. White agree) that the saved get to burn forever and ever in the true hell fire.

Okay - you have my curiosity.

hell fire does indeed burn forever

Tell me how so?

And explain true hell fire if it differs from sacred fire.

Isa 33:13  Hear, ye that are far off, what I have done; and, ye that are near, acknowledge my might.
Isa 33:14  The sinners in Zion are afraid; fearfulness hath surprised the hypocrites. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?
Isa 33:15  He that walketh righteously, and speaketh uprightly; he that despiseth the gain of oppressions, that shaketh his hands from holding of bribes, that stoppeth his ears from hearing of blood, and shutteth his eyes from seeing evil;
Isa 33:16  He shall dwell on high: his place of defense shall be the munitions of rocks: bread shall be given him; his waters shall be sure.   
Isa 33:17  Thine eyes shall see the king in his beauty: they shall behold the land that is very far off.

We have an understanding of the difference being in the presence of sacred fire versus strange. If this is what you are speaking of - yes, for eternity the saints will be in the presence of sacred fire!

[JimB]

Brother Kevin, fire has been used both God and man for purification and it will be so again. God is both love and just. I do not know what you are trying to get at but I do know that there are a couple of popular teachers in today's church that don't believe in an actual lake of fire nor in a punishment of fire. They teach that the "fire" that destroys the wicked is only psychological and not physical. But I do know that the Bible tells me that there will be neither root nor branch left and that the wicked will be ashes.

God is going to purify this earth from sin and it's effects with fire and all those holding onto sin will receive their just punishment.

Mal 4:3  And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the LORD of hosts.