Author Topic: Difficult Biblical Questions  (Read 29578 times)

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colporteur

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Re: Difficult Biblical Questions
« Reply #140 on: December 11, 2017, 07:14:04 PM »
As I understand, cp, I dont't think they face anything as do the living saints. They come up just to see the coming of Christ.

That's my understanding as well, Richard and Glen. Andrew Henrique's  belief is that those who are raised ARE living during the time between being raised and the second coming of Christ. He is right in the sense that there is a time frame there of which we know not how long that will be. However, SOP is clear at the mount of transfiguration that Moses was resurrected and Elijah was translated. I think he is trying to fit a square peg into a round hole by claiming that those resurrected are translated. Mrs. White never refers to Moses as having been translated, neither does she say that those who are raised are translated.

The 144,000 are taken from among the living, but only from the living who have never tasted death.  This rules out the righteous raised as part of the special resurrection.

The PK 227 quote listed above talks about this in the first sentence.


Glen, I did a word search on "tasted death" and could not find that quote in PK.
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Glen McCluskey

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Re: Difficult Biblical Questions
« Reply #141 on: December 12, 2017, 03:44:42 AM »
"Without tasting of death" (PK 227.2).

Another quote which says a similar thing is below.

Quote
Jesus had told His disciples that there were some standing with Him who should not taste of death till they should see the kingdom of God come with power. At the transfiguration this promise was fulfilled. The countenance of Jesus was there changed and shone like the sun. His raiment was white and glistening. Moses was present to represent those who will be raised from the dead at the second appearing of Jesus. And Elijah, who was translated without seeing death, represented those who will be changed to immortality at Christ's second coming and will be translated to heaven without seeing death. The disciples beheld with astonishment and fear the excellent majesty of Jesus and the cloud that overshadowed them, and heard the voice of God in terrible majesty, saying, "This is My beloved Son; hear Him." {EW 164.3}

Richard Myers

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Re: Difficult Biblical Questions
« Reply #142 on: December 12, 2017, 05:04:19 AM »
So, in context, if we go back a little further to see if God would bring any disease upon Israel, did He?

There is a lesson in the verse. "If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians." Many don't want to hear the lesson. Why not?

Richard, it may be that others saw your point but I'm still left thinking about it. When you asked if would bring disease upon Israel I was left thinking for examples. Immediately my mind went to Miriam but that doesn't happen until Numbers which is long after verse we are talking about. More closely at hand was the plague of boils but I can't remember off the top of my head if that was one that Hebrews were protected from.

Jim, I think that you see the point being made in the context of the verse. What did God inspire Moses to write of in Exodus 15? What is the lesson to be learned by us today from chapter 15, and how is that revealed in the verse in question?
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JimB

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Re: Difficult Biblical Questions
« Reply #143 on: August 01, 2018, 11:33:08 AM »
I see now I (we) didn't completely finish my other question and I will come back to it. However, I have another one that was asked of me and I didn't have an answer that I was satisfied with and all my normal resources are Here is passage. The question really surrounds verse 5. I was going to state the question that was asked me but I'm going to wait as now that I think about it I don't want to taint or influence any answers given. So I will do this... what is verse 5 telling us?

Micah 4:1-7

1 But in the last days it shall come to pass, that the mountain of the house of the Lord shall be established in the top of the mountains, and it shall be exalted above the hills; and people shall flow unto it.

2 And many nations shall come, and say, Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the Lord, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.

3 And he shall judge among many people, and rebuke strong nations afar off; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up a sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

4 But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig tree; and none shall make them afraid: for the mouth of the Lord of hosts hath spoken it.

5 For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of the Lord our God for ever and ever.

6 In that day, saith the Lord, will I assemble her that halteth, and I will gather her that is driven out, and her that I have afflicted;

7 And I will make her that halted a remnant, and her that was cast far off a strong nation: and the Lord shall reign over them in mount Zion from henceforth, even for ever.
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Glen McCluskey

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Re: Difficult Biblical Questions
« Reply #144 on: August 04, 2018, 11:19:26 AM »
I see now I (we) didn't completely finish my other question and I will come back to it. However, I have another one that was asked of me and I didn't have an answer that I was satisfied with and all my normal resources are Here is passage. The question really surrounds verse 5. I was going to state the question that was asked me but I'm going to wait as now that I think about it I don't want to taint or influence any answers given. So I will do this... what is verse 5 telling us?

Micah 4:1-7

5 For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of the Lord our God for ever and ever.

Micah and Isaiah were contemporaries, and Micah 4:1-3 is closely related to Isaiah 2:2-4, re the idea of spiritual restoration at some future point.  A similar theme is found in Ezekiel chapters 40-48.

There has been quite a bit of speculation about what such restoration entails, and I don't know the answer.  However, at this late point in earth's history, it seems unlikely that restoration involves the flourishing of any temporal kingdom, whether it means Israel literally restored or any other political entity like the USA.  The same is true of any temporal church.

The only thing that it seems like it could mean is the final proclamation of the full gospel to the world, for example as illustrated in the quotes below.  I'm not sure what Micah 4:5 is saying in this context, but a mundane explanation would be that some people will accept this full gospel, and others will stick with the gods they already have.

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Servants of God, with their faces lighted up and shining with holy consecration, will hasten from place to place to proclaim the message from heaven. By thousands of voices, all over the earth, the warning will be given. Miracles will be wrought, the sick will be healed, and signs and wonders will follow the believers. Satan also works, with lying wonders, even bringing down fire from heaven in the sight of men. Revelation 13:13. Thus the inhabitants of the earth will be brought to take their stand.  {GC 612.1} 

The message will be carried not so much by argument as by the deep conviction of the Spirit of God. The arguments have been presented. The seed has been sown, and now it will spring up and bear fruit. The publications distributed by missionary workers have exerted their influence, yet many whose minds were impressed have been prevented from fully comprehending the truth or from yielding obedience. Now the rays of light penetrate everywhere, the truth is seen in its clearness, and the honest children of God sever the bands which have held them. Family connections, church relations, are powerless to stay them now. Truth is more precious than all besides. Notwithstanding the agencies combined against the truth, a large number take their stand upon the Lord's side.  {GC 612.2} 

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The end is near! We have not a moment to lose! Light is to shine forth from God's people in clear, distinct rays, bringing Jesus before the churches and before the world. Our work is not to be restricted to those who already know the truth; our field is the world. The instrumentalities to be used are those souls who gladly receive the light of truth which God communicates to them. These are God's agencies for communicating the knowledge of truth to the world. If through the grace of Christ his people will become new bottles, he will fill them with the new wine. God will give additional light, and old truths will be recovered, and replaced in the frame-work of truth; and wherever the laborers go, they will triumph. As Christ's ambassadors, they are to search the Scriptures, to seek for the truths that have been hidden beneath the rubbish of error. And every ray of light received is to be communicated to others. One interest will prevail, one subject will swallow up every other,--Christ our righteousness.  {RH, December 23, 1890 par. 19} 

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The Lord God of heaven will not send upon the world His judgments for disobedience and transgression until He has sent His watchmen to give the warning. He will not close up the period of probation until the message shall be more distinctly proclaimed. The law of God is to be magnified; its claims must be presented in their true, sacred character, that the people may be brought to decide for or against the truth. Yet the work will be cut short in righteousness. The message of Christ's righteousness is to sound from one end of the earth to the other to prepare the way of the Lord. This is the glory of God, which closes the work of the third angel.  {6T 19.1}