Author Topic: Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy  (Read 2211 times)

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Richard Myers

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Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy
« on: July 06, 2015, 03:08:29 PM »
There were a number of delegates that did not want "truth" involved in the statement on the gift of property. They succeeded, the proposed changes were approved by the Session.
Jesus receives His reward when we reflect His character, the fruits of the Spirit......We deny Jesus His reward when we do not.

LindaRS

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Re: Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy
« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2015, 03:27:30 PM »
We've already been told and now we are seeing fulfillment.

The very last deception of Satan will be to make of none effect the testimony of the Spirit of God. "Where there is no vision, the people perish" (Proverbs 29:18). Satan will work ingeniously, in different ways and through different agencies, to unsettle the confidence of God's remnant people in the true testimony. He will bring in spurious visions to mislead, and will mingle the false with the true, and so disgust people that they will regard everything that bears the name of visions as a species of fanaticism; but honest souls, by contrasting false and true, will be enabled to distinguish between them.  {10MR 311.1} 

Likewise, he works through persons who have been reproved for some inconsistency in their religious life, for some course of action which was dangerous to themselves and others. Instead of receiving the testimony as a blessing from God, they refuse the means God uses to set them right. Such apparently may be very zealous for God, but they put their own interpretation upon the Word and make it contradict what the Lord has revealed in the testimonies. They think they are doing God's service, but such work God has not given them to do.  {10MR 311.2}
O Lord, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps. O Lord, correct me, but with judgment; not in thine anger, lest thou bring me to nothing. Jeremiah  10:23-24

colporteur

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Re: Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2015, 03:47:04 PM »
There were a number of delegates that did not want "truth" involved in the statement on the gift of property. They succeeded, the proposed changes were approved by the Session.

 What do you chalk that up to Richard ?   We know in some countries like the NAD it is simply rebellion but what about the church at large ?   Is it ignorance ? Is it that the SOP cuts across a lot of lives?  I know that diet, for instance, is a stumbling block even in some of  the more conservative countries. Many pastors in these countries are still eating flesh. Is it that the delegates are being overwhelmed with issues ? It seems that the delegates have been on top of these kinds of things so it makes one wonder why the concession on the SOP.
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Richard Myers

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Re: Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2015, 05:16:11 PM »
CP, there are influential leaders composing the recommendations, and presenting them before the assembly.  Some thought the wording was sufficient, and good enough to keep us out of trouble with those not have our faith.
Jesus receives His reward when we reflect His character, the fruits of the Spirit......We deny Jesus His reward when we do not.

Richard Myers

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Re: Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2015, 05:29:23 PM »
I have a clip of the discussion. I will put it up as soon as I can.
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Plain Adventist

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Re: Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2015, 05:41:05 PM »
That will be very interesting to see. This is so sad. After things went so well with Elder Wilson's vote, this is a very disappointing turn of events.

Colporteur, I think part of the danger could be in the fact that many, even conservative members, have too great confidence in the opinions of leaders. I don't know, since I don't know any of what went on. But sometimes members become swayed when someone they look up to says that this is what ought to be done. 

Now our message on the SOP is greatly weakened.
Amy Pavlovik ~~ “The strength and spirituality of the people of God are manifest by the distinctness of the line of demarcation which separates them from the world.” SW 17

John Erickson

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Re: Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2015, 07:32:30 PM »
But hold the phone, as I understand, they passed a statement entitled "Statement of Confidence in the writings of Ellen White" and it was strongly positive. I wish I could find it. I have it on my phone and was told by the Adventist Twitter operator (who has been tweeting blow-by-blow at the GC) that it passed by a wide majority. It used all the right words. Maybe it will surface soon.

Another thing to note is that you have delegates from 200 countries (many of which English is not their first language) trying to agree on wording that makes sense and sounds the same to all of them. That's a pretty tall order. I took them passing the above statement as a positive sign that, despite any disappointing changes to FB #18, the delegates clearly didn't mean to weaken our stance on EGW.

"Lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen" Matthew 28:20

Richard Myers

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Re: Fundamental Belief 18..Gift of Prophecy
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2015, 04:52:03 AM »
Yes, John, there is another opportunity to support the Spirit of Prophecy. And, the delegation is largely in support of it (the Spirit of Prophecy). And, I believe you are right in regards to the difficulty with understanding what is going on. Generally, the leadership on the platform is being trusted in areas where it is difficult to understand. I think the election of Jackson and Thomas Lemon is a good example. Most of the delegates do not know what they have done. And, sadly, the nominating committee who ought to have known, probably were somewhat ignorant of the degree to which the two men were in rebellion against the world church. There appears to be a failure at the nominating committee level where those who knew the situation did not inform the committee as to the seriousness of the break in the church. As at the local church level, what the nominating committee has presented is accepted as good. Unless there is a serious problem which sends the report back to the committee, the church (delegates) support the committee's decision. The election really takes place in the nominating committee where they are to have the knowledge of the character of the individuals. In the case of the Fundamental Beliefs and church manual, it is trust in the responsibility of the leaders who compose the proposals. Of course the delegates discuss the particulars in the case of the FBs and church manual, unlike the silence in regards to officers. But, there is still a great deal of trust placed in the current leaders who formed the proposals.

There is influence in the church when the delegates discussed the proposal to change Fundamental Belief 18. 

As I listened to the debate, there was no misunderstanding the desire of some to make the Spirit of Prophecy of "no effect". They were insistent that the word "truth" be removed from the statement of belief. As I read the proposed changes, in my opinion there was no reason to remove it. Maybe someone could post the existing and the changes made.
Jesus receives His reward when we reflect His character, the fruits of the Spirit......We deny Jesus His reward when we do not.